Journeys to Leadership

Mary Pat Matheson
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Mary Pat: [00:00:00] I think my life is a lot about serendipity and if things, if your eyes are open and opportunities come your way and you see them and you grab them and you're willing to take some kind of calculated risk, you can end up in amazing places. And that's where I ended up.

President Zak: Hello and welcome to Agnes Scott College's podcast, Journeys to Leadership, where we explore the paths of inspiring women leaders from around the globe.

President Zak: I'm Lea Kedia Zak. President of Agnes Scott and the host of this podcast. I hope that our guest stories, not only encourage you, our listeners and leaders of today and tomorrow, but they also inspire you as you take the next steps in your own journey.

President Zak: Since 2002, today's guest has served as the President and CEO of the Atlanta Botanical Garden. [00:01:00] She is responsible for raising the Garden's national profile to one of the top 10 public gardens in the United States. Under her leadership, the not for profit organization has actively expanded fundraising, education, marketing, business administration, and horticultural and conservation efforts, with a rapidly growing membership base of more than 42, 000.

President Zak: Currently, she is the driving force behind the Garden's first major property expansion since its founding in 1976. Atlanta Garden Gateway, a bold entrance to our sustainable future. A 150 million campaign that will fund the expansion of the garden 8 acres north, creating a new botanical gateway where the Atlanta Botanical Garden, Piedmont Park, and the Beltway will all converge.

President Zak: Through her leadership, the extraordinary growth in the garden attendance over the years has enabled it to [00:02:00] reach larger and broader audiences for its mission in educating the public about plant and animal conservation efforts. Originally a horticulturalist, she earned a B. S. in Resource Management and Park Planning and an Executive Master's degree in Public Administration from the University of Utah.

President Zak: Matheson previously served as president of the American Public Gardens Association and currently serves as board chair for the Midtown Alliance and is on the board of the Foodwell Alliance. For 22 years, she has been dedicated to diversifying audiences, staff, and volunteers, ensuring inclusivity and access.

President Zak: Please join me in welcoming the President and CEO of the Atlanta Botanical Garden, Mary Pat Matheson. Welcome to Journeys to Leadership, Mary Pat. We're excited to have you. Thank you. It's wonderful to be here. Well, we are just delighted. On our show, we understand that leadership doesn't just [00:03:00] happen. It's a journey.

President Zak: During our time together today, we want to explore your journey. The ups, the down, the surprises, or at least all of it that we can get into. So let's begin. First of all, you could not have a more beautiful place to come to work every day. So tell us a little bit about the botanical garden.

Mary Pat: I love that. Um, it is a beautiful place to come to work, but it's interesting when we hire people, often people think, Oh, I want to work there because it's so beautiful.

Mary Pat: It's going to be so easy. Every day it's about flowers and sunshine. That's just not the case. We work hard here, but when we do work hard and we get stressed, we can go for a walk in the garden and that really helps everything. So the botanical garden is really, um, Atlanta is one of Atlanta's top cultural destinations.

Mary Pat: And it's for everyone. It's where people can come and learn about plants. A big part of our focus and mission is [00:04:00] connecting people to plants, because we live in a more urban environment and more urbanized world than we ever have in the history of mankind. So more people live in cities. And so we forget that we are animals too.

Mary Pat: And so the walk in the sunshine or through the woods, forest bathing, those are important things for human health and mental health. So, um, obviously during the COVID years, there's We proved how important the garden was to people for their mental and physical health because they could come here and be safe.

Mary Pat: Uh, and, and so everything we've known all these years has proven to be true. And, and the garden is here as a resource for beauty, enjoyment, relaxation. And then the deeper side of what the Atlanta Botanical Garden is about is also saving plants because our planet is imperiled. And biodiversity, which is how insects and birds feed on plants and survive and then other animals feed on them and [00:05:00] the complexity of nature, it is getting lost very rapidly.

Mary Pat: So we have a large plant conservation program really focused on that effort. And that's the deeper dive into what the garden does.

President Zak: Well, I want to thank you on behalf of Agnes Scott College. You recently hosted a group of our students as part of our sophomore class, Atlanta Leadership Experience. I know they had a wonderful time.

President Zak: And I also know that you had an opportunity to have a conversation with them about leadership. So you know, they always want to know what makes a leader. So let's step back a little bit. Um, how about for you, where did you grow up and did you know this was something you wanted to

Mary Pat: do? Oh heavens, no. I was the wild child, right?

Mary Pat: I was the middle in a family of five children and I grew up in Bethesda, Maryland. So, um, I was fortunate. In my, in my youth, we could go outside, get on our bicycles and be gone all day. Well, we'd come back for lunch and then we'd be gone again. [00:06:00] So we played in the woods, we played in the fields, we played, I had friends and I played on bicycles.

Mary Pat: In a thing called the Dirt Pile, which we didn't know what it was, but one day it became the Beltway in Washington, D. C. So, um, we could be free, and we weren't tied to the house, and we weren't tied to computers, and we weren't tied to social media. I think it was a great time to grow up. It was incredible.

Mary Pat: Uh, and a beautiful part of our country to live in. Um, but I was not, I didn't know what I wanted to be when I was little. I think I was inoculated. Pretty young though, um, by my father who loved the garden, my mother who loved the garden, and my best friend's father, Mr. White, who had the best vegetable garden in Bethesda, where we could sneak in and raid his peaches and eat those luscious tomatoes.

Mary Pat: And I think that was an inoculation into the world of plants for me. And I didn't realize it at the time, but it influenced me and my career, obviously.

President Zak: And so, was it something that you just sought education [00:07:00] about subsequently? How did you make that connection from walking in the woods and having fresh vegetables to what you're doing today?

Mary Pat: I have a lot of lawyers in my family and I knew 100 percent I wasn't going to be a lawyer. Oh, you just broke my heart. You just broke my heart. I'm sorry. Are you an attorney? Yes, I am. Forgive me. I have nothing against the law. Lawyers have helped me a lot in my career, uh, including my brothers and my father.

Mary Pat: But But, uh, I knew I wanted to run from that profession, it just wasn't me. And I wanted to do something that would be connected to nature. So I went out to Utah, I wasn't from Utah, I didn't know anything about, um, the community, the culture, or anything. But I loved the Rocky Mountains and I wanted to study wildlife management.

Mary Pat: And that's what I started out in, in, in, at Utah State University. And it wasn't long before I became a little uncertain about what my role would be. And this is going to be really, really relevant to the Scotties because I went to meet a counselor who was a [00:08:00] white man, um, and I said, what will I do when I'm done?

Mary Pat: What with this degree. What's my job opportunity? And he said, well, you know, because you're a woman, there aren't many opportunities in, in fish and wildlife or the forest service or the park service for women. Oh my goodness. This is true. 1970. You could be a journalist, you could write about it, or you could be a secretary in an office.

Mary Pat: This is a college counselor telling me that. And I left there and I dropped out, and I said, I'm not going to do that. Oh my goodness. So what did you do instead? I came to my senses. I ended up a year in a horticulture program. Um, and, and it was weird. I think he gave me the worst advice he could have given me because affirmative action in the federal agencies came in just a few years later and women were, um, very desirable in those fields.

Mary Pat: But I think I might not have been as happy in those fields as I Ended up in horticulture and planning, so I [00:09:00] spent a year in horticulture, and then moved to Salt Lake City and ended up in a bachelor's degree around park planning And resource management, and that was great because planning is really in my DNA I've planned and master planned and helped build two major gardens in the United States Uh, and was fortunate enough to be hired.

Mary Pat: Tell us what those gardens are. We want to know. Well, obviously Atlanta, where I was recruited to be here in 2002, but before that, I was at a garden called Red Butte Garden at the University of Utah, and it was a baby garden when I started as the director of horticulture, and I was very fortunate. We had a donor who sent the director and me across the country.

Mary Pat: the United States, and over to England to look at different gardens to learn from them as we started to master plan that new garden. What an experience for a young woman. So, I think my life is a lot about serendipity and if things If your eyes are open and opportunities come your way and you see them and you grab [00:10:00] them, and you're willing to take some kind of calculated risk, you can end up in amazing places.

Mary Pat: And that's where I ended up.

President Zak: I have to say, I can't tell you how much I love to hear that. I always talk about the importance of being open to new things. Yes. And being willing to take the risk at the same time. You obviously had someone who gave you not great advice. Did you have people who did give you good advice?

President Zak: Um, and you have a lot of people in your office that mentored you and who might those be?

Mary Pat: I did. Absolutely. Um, I would say one arena of which I've had multiple colleagues who are mentors and supporters and, uh, you know, someone I could just tell all our, my challenges to are a number of people who are and have been CEOs in my field.

Mary Pat: They weren't when I knew them when we were young horticulturists. Um, we would, you know, talk about this opportunity, the gardens we were in, the challenges we were having, and how to get around those [00:11:00] issues, and how to be better leaders. And fortunately, um, three of those men are still dear friends of mine.

Mary Pat: All three are now retired. I'm the only one still working. Um, but I really could lean on them for advice, even taking this job. For instance, a colleague of mine. Who is a dear friend now and retired said, you know, Mary Pat, when you get recruited, you are in the same position as the recruiter is. They can ask you questions and you can ask back because you don't necessarily have to go.

Mary Pat: And remember when you go to an organization or a botanical garden. That appears a little bit broken. You can fix mission, finance, budget, all of those things. What you can't fix is a broken board of trustees because they're not your peers. And that was some of the best advice I ever got because when I came to Atlanta, uh, the gardens board was way too big.

Mary Pat: It was 68 and people were not Um, rotating off, and I, in the interview, said you have to fix [00:12:00] that before I come. And to the credit of the executive committee here, they did. It was remarkable. So, I listened to good mentors. I had another amazing mentor. Um, Red Butte Garden is part of the University of Utah, and I reported to Ted Kaepner when I became the director there, who was the, um, vice president of outreach at the University of Utah at the time.

Mary Pat: Terrific. Big thinker. And he was a great mentor to me, and he was one of those who appreciated taking calculated risks, encouraged the thinking of what are the upsides and the downsides, and then if we made calculated risks, he would be supportive of that. And you know, it's not always easy to do things that are big and bold at a university.

Mary Pat: Some universities, the big, this was a research one university, is today. I want to say they breed mediocrity because it's challenging to make change at a university that's very bureaucratic. And he was supportive of [00:13:00] us doing that because we were building a new garden, botanical garden that most people didn't even understand at the time.

Mary Pat: So mentors and people who will give you guidance are so essential in life.

President Zak: Well, I have to say it's one of the reasons why I love being at Agnes Scott College, because we are number one in the country for innovation. So, it's one of the places where we really do focus on how do we get things done and look toward the future.

President Zak: Um, I think it's one of the wonderful things about being at a gem, um, like Agnes Scott.

Mary Pat: Congratulations on that. Well done on the leadership around innovation. That is so important. It's so important. And it's always so important to keep breaking down the barriers of bureaucracies so that we collaborate and can be entrepreneurial and innovative.

Mary Pat: That's awesome.

President Zak: Well, thank you. And it's one of my favorite things to do is to break down bureaucracy. I can tell you that. And everyone on the campus will, will know that. Ironically, I came from government, um, where people thought there was a lot of bureaucracy and you know, in that agency, we were able to make change and again, [00:14:00] very fortunate.

President Zak: Um, to be at Agnes Scott, but tell me, you, you talk about the mentors you've had, I suspect as a result, you now are a mentor to others. What is that like? Do people come to you? Did you go to them? How does that, so many people want to know how that relationship begins.

Mary Pat: You know, it comes about in so many different ways.

Mary Pat: Um, many years ago. It was, uh, a national meeting that we go to every year where they did leadership roundtables, um, and on, you know, one afternoon during the conference. And they would have different topics that we would talk about, which is really great. You know, thought, thoughtful topics. And they'd also had a bar open so you could have a glass of wine.

Mary Pat: Because what does that do? It sort of breaks down your inhibitions. And so you could have frank conversations. And I was I was leading a conversation and there was someone, um, young in the field at the table and asking about how you get into a leadership role like I did and, and [00:15:00] I said to him just off the cuff, well, you need to get off the stick.

Mary Pat: You need to get to it. There are needs out there in the community and beyond your community for your leadership. You have to get your name out there. You have to be willing to move. And years later, he came back and told me that I, I was. The reason why he did do that and interestingly enough, he later became the president of our association because he did take that risk and decided to move around.

Mary Pat: And now he's running a different botanical garden. So that's one that was sort of accidental mentoring. But now, Um, some come about more deliberately, uh, where people will come and ask me if, especially new young leaders for nonprofits, if I will mentor them. And it's just over a cup of coffee and a conversation.

Mary Pat: And I find that mentorship works both ways. So what they learn from me, I learn a lot from them as well. And that is just very rewarding.

President Zak: And that is so wonderful. And it's interesting. One of the themes we found in doing our [00:16:00] podcast is how often. Someone gives someone a nudge and or someone doesn't recognize their talent until it's pointed out by someone else.

President Zak: And it often reminds me that I have to point it out in others that we have to be sure to let them know.

Mary Pat: I love that. And I think And I think not only is that true, but it's even more true of women, right? We undervalue ourselves. We have less confidence sometimes than men, and sometimes just that encouragement and that nudge to say there's greatness in you and you need to have a voice at the table can make a huge difference in a young person's life.

Mary Pat: So I think we need to do that and encourage young people to have voices and trust themselves and confidence. And when they don't know something. Be willing to say that and learn from that, because we can learn from one another and get better all the time. Nobody knows it all, right?

President Zak: Absolutely, absolutely.

President Zak: We're learning

Mary Pat: [00:17:00] every day.

President Zak: I hope

Mary Pat: so. If we stop learning, then I don't know what else is left in life. You know, it's a, it's a lifelong journey.

President Zak: Well, it's also interesting you made a couple moves across the country, you know, from Bethesda to Utah to Atlanta. What attracted you to Atlanta and also to make those moves?

Mary Pat: Oh, it's funny. Um, I grew up in D. C. DC, Bethesda is an extension of DC, at a really tumultuous time. I mean, my father was the head of the civil division in the Justice Department and when we were young, he came home and had us hold hands around the dinner table and said President Kennedy is about to do a blockade in Cuba and if this doesn't go well.

Mary Pat: The Russians will bomb our country. In the first place, they'll bomb will be our homes. And if that doesn't, if that does happen, and we don't survive, at least we'll die as a family. Oh, my goodness. That was, I was like, what, five or six years old. Oh. And fortunately, President Kennedy [00:18:00] was right on that. And that turned out well for our nation.

Mary Pat: And then, you know, So, the President Kennedy was assassinated, Martin Luther King was assassinated, Washington D. C. burned, um, Bobby Kennedy was assassinated, and then the Vietnam War rolled in. So it was a tough time for me as a young woman. Trying to figure out what I wanted to do in life and not really, uh, believing in things like the war and, you know, I, I was on one side of that, my father on another, so I wanted to get out of Dodge.

Mary Pat: I was ready to go to the Rocky Mountains and just breathe in the fresh air and hike and, you know, learn about animals and wildlife and that was really good for me and I lived in a family or had a family that really encouraged exploration, going to college, making choices. 20 years. And in life and not being afraid.

Mary Pat: So then when I was recruited, I had been at Red Butte for 20 years. It was time if I was going to make a change and be CEO of somewhere else, it was time. [00:19:00] But when Atlanta called, I was like, I had that Southern stereotype. I didn't want to be in the South and I didn't want to come to Atlanta. And the head hunter kept calling me.

Mary Pat: I must have talked to her five different times and she'd say Mary Pat just come visit just have a meeting with us And I kept saying no. And so she called me one day and she said, Okay Mary Pat, what airport will you be in in the United States in the next two weeks? And I said, I'm going to Boston next Thursday for business.

Mary Pat: She's like, will you give me an hour? And I was like, you're going to come to Boston? And she said, yes. So she flew to Boston and we met. Well, first of all, this is

President Zak: such a testament to you. Oh, they thought you were, you know, their candidate that they pursued you. I mean, congratulations. Well, for that.

Mary Pat: I had done a lot at Red Butte and the garden here was ready.

Mary Pat: To do the kinds of things that I like to do, which is kick the doors off the place and welcome the entire community, which was not happening then. So, [00:20:00] thank you for that. It is, it was amazing. It was very flattering. So she was wonderful in that she talked about Atlanta and the home of, the land of civil rights, and how Atlanta was a prosperous, thriving, growing city.

Mary Pat: She called it the Northern City in the South. I kind of think that's true, but I also think it's Atlanta. It's a Southern city, uh, with more of an international attitude now, which I love about it. And so my husband and I talked about it and agreed I would come and really coming to see this garden, which back then was just a young baby garden, seeing where it was in Midtown, looking at what was going on in Atlanta.

Mary Pat: Uh, and the leadership here was really remarkable, and that was convincing to all, all of us. And when I, I was offered the job, I told my son, who was 14, and my husband, I don't want to be responsible for your happiness. And if one person votes not to do it, we won't go. And so we [00:21:00] came to Atlanta to visit, and my husband gave us each a poker chip.

Mary Pat: And he said, when the time comes to vote, we'll go one, two, three, and if we each have a chip. We'll move.

President Zak: Well, you talked about when you arrived, it was a, this baby garden is this spectacular garden with a national and international reputation. So you've accomplished so much here and you're about to begin a big new project.

President Zak: Could you share with the audience a little bit about that project?

Mary Pat: Oh yeah, I got goosebumps as soon as you said it. This project, it's been seven years in the making. Um, yeah, yeah. Pre COVID, uh, it was an idea that someone who's a big community leader and supporter, you know, mentioned to me one day when we were together on our canopy walk, could the garden expand?

Mary Pat: You know, if there was ever an opportunity to expand, it would be now, before property values in Atlanta would change. Went through the roof, which they have done So I started looking at properties next door and engaged some Colleagues and mentors and said is this a good idea or [00:22:00] crazy and they loved it.

Mary Pat: And so the big idea is to Expand the garden by eight acres will be one garden one connected garden, but with two front doors So the current front doors off of piedmont and the prado And it's largely driven by people coming in cars. And the new front door will be off the Atlanta Beltline. And you know, the Atlanta Beltline in the next four years will be complete.

Mary Pat: 22 mile loop. There's nothing like it in the world. It's going to and already has changed the way we move through our city. Just ask any young people including your Scotty's. They walk it, they bike it, they scooter it, and our new front door will be on the Beltline. We will be the only cultural destination on the Atlanta Beltline.

Mary Pat: So I like to say if you go to the High Line, you know the Whitney is there. At the front of the High Line or the headwaters of the High Line, we're going to be the Whitney on the Beltline.

President Zak: That is, it's so exciting. I know the whole community is looking forward to it. It's such an amazing [00:23:00] project. We're absolutely thrilled about that.

Mary Pat: It's really transformational and I, we would never have jumped into a 150 million campaign because that's big for us. If it wasn't for the nature of this project that it is transformational that. People will be able to come to the garden by foot or by scooter or by bicycle long into the future and from a sustainability perspective, that is really important.

Mary Pat: And everything will be designed around thoughtful, sustainable design, um, with bold, beautiful new gardens and plant collections.

President Zak: An initiative like that takes such leadership. You also have a variety of constituents. Yes. What does that mean to you? How do you, how do you distinguish your constituents? How do you, how do you bring everybody together?

Mary Pat: I love that question and you know, I, I get a lot of credit as the leader for the garden But I always try to push back and let people understand. [00:24:00] This is a team This is a group of people who are committed to nature and the environment And to this beautiful city that we live in as well as to the world at large.

Mary Pat: So You know, we're constituents are from I, when I got here, I taught our staff to think about the visitors the most important of all. Because if they don't come through the front door, you don't have people taking classes, you don't have members, you don't have donors, and you don't have volunteers. And that's what makes us sing.

Mary Pat: So we've got visitors, we now have 50, 000 member houses. The largest, uh, membership program in the, in the city. And we have donors. Think about this garden as an example of philanthropy. We have raised, to date, with the campaign we're in today, about 101 million. Before that, since I got here in 2002, we had raised Over 150 million to build the gardens that you know and love today, including our Gainesville garden Every penny is [00:25:00] philanthropic.

Mary Pat: That is remarkable. And that is the statement about the generosity of the people in atlanta So that's a huge constituency And I can't name all the big donors to our campaign, but they're on our website and will be named elsewhere but You know, uh, two of them made this project happen or we wouldn't be here today.

Mary Pat: And, and then you've got volunteers who give their time and energy and passion to the garden and meet and greet our visitors and help us in the garden. Um, and then of course our staff, we couldn't do it without a talented team. So it truly is a village.

President Zak: Well, thank you so much for sharing all of this. I want to thank you for sharing your story.

President Zak: Do you have any last minute, um, words of encouragement for our listeners about becoming a leader?

Mary Pat: I do. I think that the world we live in today is fraught with challenges and it starts. Perhaps with the iPhone in our hands because [00:26:00] we're 24 7, bombarded with bad news, not good news. When I read the papers online, I'm always looking for the good stories because they're there, they're just not promoted.

Mary Pat: So we have to protect ourselves from that and really, um, know how to live in this world. But, but we also know that if we're gonna do well. As human beings in a beautiful world that we have been gifted to take care of and be involved in, we have to be active in leadership roles on so many levels. So, to me, the environment is number one.

Mary Pat: Climate change is such a huge issue for us, and it's frustrating. People close their eyes and, you know, want to tear their hair out when you talk about it. But start with the small things. What can you do at home? What can you do individually? And then as a leader, what can you do to not only Do something relevant and important in the world we live in, in our community, but don't forget that you have a role to play as a steward of the earth.

Mary Pat: I don't care if you're an attorney, a doctor, or you [00:27:00] run a botanical garden, we all have a part to play in stewarding the life of the earth. That lives on this earth. And if you can look at that through that lens and start with small things that are important. Don't spray your lawn, for instance, with pesticides and herbicides.

Mary Pat: You can still have a beautiful lawn and have butterflies and bees and healthy children. That's what I'm talking about. So there's leadership at so many levels, but we have to step up. to turn things around and have a healthy future for our planet and our people.

President Zak: Well, I hope through this podcast, we can be sure that the good news gets out about the botanical garden, about Agnes Scott, about all the wonderful leaders.

President Zak: that we have, especially the women leaders who are so important to the future. So thank you so much for taking the time to have this conversation today. To our listeners, I hope you were encouraged and inspired. Mary Pat Matheson's journey is one of many that we're thrilled to share with you. Thank you for listening.

President Zak: [00:28:00] And thank you to our producers, Sydni Perry, for making this podcast possible. I am Leo Kadia Zak, and this is Journeys to Leadership.